Manhattan Loft Guy

Feb. 21, 2007 - more bad / agent’s misbehavin’

and we wonder why the public holds us in such … esteem

Real estate agents get a lot of bad press. I sometimes think that one reason that is true in Manhattan is that so many people have their first experience with a real estate agent when they rent an apartment, and rental agents are (in the view of some) more prone to advertise apartments that don’t exist, more likely to imply they have the renter’s best interests in mind (though they represent the landlord), and are more often the source of complaints to the Department of State.

More than agents who handle sales, I mean. But it ain’t necessarily so. And REBNY ain’t necessarily able to be ethics cop.

the case of the missing listing

I recently had a client I had been working with for a while send me a link to a NYTimes.com listing. We worked together long enough for me to be confident I knew what they wanted as far as price, size, light, finishes, amenities – at least 8.5 of 9 yards. So when they sent me the link I wondered if I had missed something. (It bothers me if someone I am working with finds something of interest I have not sent them.)

I was confident enough to reply that I would find out about the listing, but that I believed it was either bogus or a new development not found in our inter-firm data base.

When I reached the agent on his cell phone, he explained that it was a listing that ‘had just gone into contract’ at a building I knew had its own in-house sales staff. In other words, it was – at best – an ‘open listing’ that he could have brought buyers to, if only it was not in contract.

Lots of firms permit agents to advertise open listings in order to attract buyers who might be persuaded to buy something else. Not my way to do business, but nothing too wrong with that if done right. An expensive way to attract buyers, but that is the firms’ decision.

But this one bugged me because it appeared to me (and perhaps to my clients) that I may have missed something that they could have bought that suited them.

So I checked the past listing data for that building.

can you spell bait-and-switch?

Turns out the ad was for (a) a 29^th floor unit with terrace in a 40-story building (not a “penthouse”) (b) in a former office building (not a “warehouse”), (c) the asking price was $300k more than the ad said (although it actually did close at close to the ad’s price, and the common charges were very close).

If this sounds like quibbling about a February 2007 web ad, consider that the unit closed on August 8, 2006. Oops – forgot to pull the ad.

In other words, they advertised an apartment for sale that had been unavailable for half a year because somebody else bought it.

Just in case I mis-understood the guy on the phone – and somehow found an eerily parallel listing that had closed – I sent him an email asking if I had the facts straight. That was 2 weeks ago, so I don’t think I made any mistake.

And the ad is no longer on NYTimes.com.

One small step for mankind….

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Feb. 22, 2007 - re: more bad / agent’s misbehavin’

Posted by Howard

I once responded to a NYT listing for a pre-construction pricing sale of unit in a new building (turned out to be Astor Place) in Jan 07. This was an open listing which was fine but the ad was very deceptive. The actual broker was on holiday so I was interacting with the company president and I complained. He basically seemed to think that they did nothing wrong since it was an expensive property. I felt it was a bait and switch or at least a blatant misrepresentation.

This is a REBNY broker. I looked at the REBNY site at the time and couldn't find anyway to complain. My conclusion was that REBNY doesn't mean anything. Now, if it isn't from one of the big four or five firms, I just ignore it entirely because I assume the ads are not credible.

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Feb. 22, 2007 - re: more bad / agent’s misbehavin’

Posted by Sandy Mattingly

One problem is that the firms that do this don’t care that many people ignore them after figuring out they are bogus, because there seems to be an unending supply of people who don’t make that connection, and end up calling.

I am not defending the ad that drew you in, but at least there was a real apartment lurking behind the ad (mis-described as it may have been). Shady people might argue about how misleading is really misleading; but there are ads out there for units that are not available for sale.

As it turns out, that ‘small step’ I mentioned was a rather small step, as the offending ad is gone from NYTimes.com but the sold-last-August “listing” is still on his website. My guy’s business plan is to be a source for downtown loft listings, and he has 95 “listings” on his Agent Profile page (under “see my listings”). Most of them have the look of open new development listings, though I have no idea how many are actually still for sale. Interesting that the one I noticed (in a quick scan) that has a specific indicator of which building it is appears to be an actual exclusive listing the guy had (and sold). So some of this appears to be legit.

As you say, REBNY does not make it easy to complain. Are they worried about being overwhelmed if they post on the public portion of their website a click-here-to-complain button?

THX for stopping by Howard.

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on matters of interest to Manhattan coop or condo loft apartment dwellers, buyers, sellers, and others, especially about New York City real estate

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Manhattan Loft Guy

Feb. 21, 2007 - more bad / agent’s misbehavin’

Feb. 22, 2007 - re: more bad / agent’s misbehavin’

Feb. 22, 2007 - re: more bad / agent’s misbehavin’

Nov. 14, 2009 - RE:

Nov. 25, 2009 - Lebron James Shoes

Nov. 25, 2009 - bailey button uggs

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